General Overseer of Bible Life Christian Church, Ajegunle, Lagos, Bishop (Prof.) Leonard Umunna marked his 62nd birthday anniversary with a variety of activities in his church including Bible Quiz, debate on the topic: ‘Is God partial?’ with plenty to eat and drink. At the end, the celebrant granted an interview with reporters present where he took a look at the state of the nation. SAM EYOBOKA was there. Excerpts…

How does it feel to be 62 years and in the service of the Lord?

I feel like I am just beginning, because I have acquired experience, knowledge—not enough really—but it is good, better, best every other year. I have never had a better yesterday. It has always been good yesterday, better today and best tomorrow.

At 62 could you to take a look at the state of the Nigerian nation?

Nigeria is now a laughing stock among many people all over the world. In the comity of nations, it has rated less then ‘A’ again. You know you have a list. Africa is not even in ‘A’ list in the real sense of it. Football, it in reverse process; economy wise, it is in reverse process and we have been named one that had the best economy. Now, we are not even a good economy. What do you want me to say of Nigeria now? When we were young, we enjoyed Nigeria, but we didn’t know. We thought we would enjoy it better without the Europeans. But now we know that some of our leaders did not learn from the Europeans before they took over. They had programmes and the manag-ed it well; this is the reality. If my children were to have a bit of what we had: Is it the streets where we walked between orchards?; is it the schools where you will go to school in your uniform and return clean?; Is it in the office when you graduate, you have a car waiting for you to do the job?; Is it in the home, you will sleep fine and wake up? What is that you are proud of about Nigeria now? Let somebody tell me! You have heard of light. Then we had Electrical Corporation of Nigeria (ECN). Then we were proud of ourselves in the comity of nations. Our pound, shilling and pens then now Naira and Kobo were enough match for any inter-national currency. Is it educational attainment, any certificate you had in Nigeria you will stand with your equals anywhere. If our people travelled abroad we were honoured. The other time I went to America, I was the only one who carried the Nigerian flag. It was demand-ed that all of us should come with our national flags. All the other Nigerians that went with me, none did. But God honoured me because they looked down on me as if I was the most corrupt person in that international program-me.

I was sort of humiliated at the airport let alone in the place. But when they raised my resume, they knew that this person is different. When we lined up to wash the feet of people, it fell on my lot to wash the feet of the most prominent prophet there. Immediately I took her feet, the anointing took over, she landed on the ground. She tried to get up, she landed on the ground again. People began to look and they said that is that man who carried the Nigerian flag. Honour came back. It is people who have purity and integrity that God can support nowadays.

At what point did Nigeria began to nose-dive?

CUTTING BIRTHDAY CAKE: Bishop (Prof.) Leonard Umunna, the celebrant, flanked by some guests, cutting his 62nd birthday cake

The trouble started before the Nigerian Civil War. Yes, the one of oil was after Gowon and Co; when they felt that they have gotten enough and nobody should have tele-phones, this and that. Before the civil war, there was heavy disenchantment in the West – Operation Wetiee. That tribal, regional statement began to be punitive. Like the present administration now has further polarized Nigeria. Before, we were a bit united, at least, believing in our government that we have a Nigerian government. But now, they don’t believe that there is a Nigerian govern-ment.

That was before the war?

Yes. Now this one is before virtually another war, worsen-ing things. That was what triggered it; all these Operat-ion wetiee. What made the Nzeogwus to take over? Was it not this kind of thing: political appointments, when some get in, you put only your tribes men, members of your political party. Was it not what started it then? Then there was a counter coup. The same thing is happening now. We are polarized now more. We were never so divided in tribalism, religion, in govern-ment as now. Then it was step one, now its step two. What do you want me to say? It is there in the history book. It is here with us again.

Are we at the verge of a revolution?

We are in a revolution already. It is only that the powers that be are suppress-ing them. There’s revolution in the North; there is revolution in the East; there is revolution in the West; and also at the center. Didn’t you hear that they are planning a coup?

Even in the Niger Delta?

I said in the East, not only in the Niger Delta. I told you people the other time that there is no part of Nigeria that is not marginalized. Now that they have found something to vent their spleen, this ranch-ing and that party corruption charge, no! Everywhere now, Boko Haran has not stopped because ISIS are restrate-gising; they feel that the man who was in league with them did not do well. They asked him to do this; he did that. He was using children and female to bomb. They said don’t do it, he did it. That is why they suffered damage; now they are restrategising. They want Islamic State. Go to the East, you think that they have kept quiet, but they have taken to arms. It is only that their leaders are not pleased with them because it will affect the leadership more now. It could have been easier in the time of Odumegwu Ojukwu because then they had guns and soldiers but now they are not finding it easy. Let truth be told. Even you yourself here now you are not sitting comfortable. You are sitting on a keg of gun powder: any day there is a bang you could be thrown off jobs. Instead of promotion it is a demotion. I told you that I am not prepared to talk to the press about this govern-ment because all the wonder-ful good ideas that God gave immediately some other governments heard that Bishop Umunna said this thing fine and God helped them.  But now you talk and talk it will seem as if you are just like others talking.

What is the solution?

Let’s start from the head; that is where the issue starts rotten. Buhari should reshuffle his cabinet.

That’s not the head. The head is Buhari himself….

Buhari is the one that invited them. I said let’s start from the head. Buhari should reshuffle his cabinet. He is the head of Nigeria now. He should restructure Nigeria and restructure each ministry; and spread it down the ladder.

What do you mean by that?

The regional clime was better. You have started federalism; you are running nothing less than unitary. It is military. The Western side, the Eastern side and the Northern side, ask them; they were better. After the war, I heard Gowon dividing Nigeria into 12 states. Later, it became political division; so that the wife of Babangida will have a state for her parents. And this time, it didn’t serve the purpose again. May be God used it to avoid unnecessary power belonging to the blocs and so that it can easily be check-mated. But now it has gone as far as security, to politics. What else do you want? If you want to correct these things, start from the head.

Should we then go back to the national conference recommendations or a referendum?

When I recommended a referendum before the coming in of the Buhari administration, it was good then. But now, I don’t think that a referendum will even agree that we should be together. The current realities will make them to say let’s part our ways. That’s why I am saying restructure. The truth about this is, this nation has refused to take the right advice I gave them. They should change the constitut-ion. Not amend it; change the name. It has a spiritual vibration that will make it to continue like this; striving to progress and not making any head way. If they don’t change the constitution in line with the current reality all the problems we are passing through they are the things that we are to solve forget about oil, this and that. Nobody would want to be cheated. I was coming from Pakistan the other time passing through Dubai, and came back.  I said oooo, it is a question of time now that the whole world has opened our eyes, before we see war between the Delta people and the state. Now that oil has been found in Lagos and others are saying they have and this and that; injustice is in the land. They left this land …oh it is for our people, that is the problem. Then I say that there is no nation or state that is oil producing that is not living better than Nigeria. How do you dash me my thing, and tell me to keep quiet? Where the greatest injustice is, is in our nation.

The last CAN election has sort of divided Christians in Nigeria….

It is a product of our economy and realities in our nation. Righteousness exalts a nation when you have a right leader at the top. Whether you believe it or not, your foremost leader is an indication of peace. Once there is economic restoration, once there is good leadership at the top, you will see that it will affect CAN; affect Cherubim and Sera-phim, Apostolic Church, Bible Life Church, Roman Catholic and every other church. But the center cannot hold, as Chinua Achebe said, once the kind of thing you are seeing is all about.

For that of CAN, let’s see what happened during Jonathan/Ayo Oritsejafor regime of CAN because politics has come into it. The division is also at the state level; we are further polarized.  Buhari has come to polarize Christians more. Some leaders in the North said God said Buhari would win, some other said Buhari would lose and some told Jonathan that God has vowed that he must return. It shouldn’t be so. God is not interested in whether you come from this religion or that to lead this nation. Christians should tread softly on the issue of Ishmaelite will not. Even God allowed an Egyptian, Jeroboam, to rule Israel not to talk of Nigeria.

Will President Buhari be the last president of Nigeria?

I don’t predict. God has told me to keep quiet. And He has not told me about Buhari. He is the only president that God told me not to say anything. During the time of Jonathan, I wanted to correct him about all his weaknesses, but God said don’t correct him that He has a purpose for which he put him there. Towards the end we saw it. He saved Nigeria from war. But I don’t assure you that there will be no war for now. I don’t assure you that there will be no Nigeria. But going by the pace of things, unless some-thing is done quickly, sorry, one of these days you may ask how is Nigeria and they will ask which part but they can remedy it.